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HairyHammer 2:01 Thu Feb 18
China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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Russia have apparently sent a missile to a disputed island with Taiwan and Russia has had a go at Ukrain and is flexing its muscles against Turkey. Is Communism getting an erection once more.
Or is the loss of prosperity in China and Russia the real issue ?
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Replies - In Chronological Order ( Show Newest Messages First)
Far Cough
2:25 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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Err, Russia is not communist is it?
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Saul Bollox
2:32 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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Yes, yes, yes
err er no, no
I don't fucking know
Fuck 'em
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HairyHammer
3:57 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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Two Russian bombers were heading for the UK only yesterday afternoon, RAF jets were scrambled to intercept them, the question is why does Russia do this ?.
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HairyHammer
4:01 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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Far cough
Well so they say but the authoritarian manner and secretive nature to me say's nothing much has changed from the past apart from a small minority making loadsa bonce.
I used Communism because two of the countries I mentioned were Communist not too long ago Putin served it proudly too.
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ILOVEPAOLODICANIO
4:08 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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THe leaders just have to blow a little hot air.
And some hot air is OK.
Thing is Putin and Russia's economy getting fucked really only fucks over rich Russians abroad when the Rouble is worthless. Domestically life continues much the same.
Rich ex pats can be fucked over with the exchange rate and thats all that really happens when things like this kick up.
Bush started a war in 2001 instead of just releasing some hot air. Some tough talk would have been a more appropriate response than that innit?
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Infidel
10:23 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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Communism?
Oh dear...WHO plumbs new depths of ignorance
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HairyHammer
10:43 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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Infidel
I do know that Communism is now supposedly extinguished to capitalism, but the threats and actions remain as they did back when.
China and Russia are losing prosperity very quickly, think about it, its all going down when desperation comes to play.
How can you play the game of Capitalism with no money ?
The two country's have a decent enough red majority who preferred things the way they were before.
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HairyHammer
10:46 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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Infidel
We were all happy Europeans not so long ago now we want to be British English, it is all only a hop and skip away, if the leaders wish to play it that way.
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ILOVEPAOLODICANIO
10:46 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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HairyHammer 10:43 Thu Feb 18
FUCK SAKE did 13 Br Road cut your hair today and whisper sweet nothings in your ear?
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Mr Anon
10:49 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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HairyHammer 3:57 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
Two Russian bombers were heading for the UK only yesterday afternoon, RAF jets were scrambled to intercept them, the question is why does Russia do this ?.
That is so common, I'm suprised it even made the news- they do it to terst response times and happened almost every day for 20 years before the soviet collapse.
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HairyHammer
10:56 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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Mr Anon
So they are just playing War games ?
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Mr Anon
10:58 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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HairyHammer 10:56 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
Yes exactly, it's so routine it's probably considered a joint exercise.
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Infidel
11:04 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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Hairy
No, the threat and actions are not remotely the same as they were when Russia was run by the Soviet Communists.
The USSR was locked in an arms race with the West between 1945 and 1989. We came to the brink of a nuclear war during the Cuban missile crisis that would have wiped out most of humanity - and that was just one of several near misses.
Russia poses no threat whatsoever to the West today. There is no chance - absolutely zero - of the Kremlin launching any nuclear strikes on any other state. We live in a new and much less dangerous world since the fall of the Berlin Wall.
Russia defends its interests robustly, as indeed do many other countries. When it does so it attracts comments from people like you that 'nothing has changed' since the days of the USSR, which means you outrageously equate conventional military engagements in an obscure part of eastern Ukraine with global thermonuclear war. How can these two things be considered even remotely equivalent?
As for China, it manifestly isn't communist any more because (i) it doesn't have a centrally planned economy and (ii) it does not even attempt to equalise economic outcomes amongst its citizens.
It is also not getting poorer, as you mistakenly stated. It is getting richer, just at a slower rate than before.
Italy is getting poorer - GDP down 12% since 2008. Greece is getting poorer (GDP down 22%). But China is galloping ahead with economic growth outstripping the rest of the world comfortably. The BRICS in total will grow GDP 4-5% this year, a rate which doubles the size of their economy every 15-20 years.
The real threat the world faces today is not Russia or China but the threat to the market economy - the greatest engine of prosperity ever invented - from the alarming rise of socialism in the democratic West, and to a lesser extent the security threats from the spread of radical Islam.
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BRANDED
11:06 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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You tel em inf
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,
11:09 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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Infidel can you explain how democratic socialism is a threat please? Oh and what proportion of this world's population is it a threat to?
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the exile
11:13 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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Infidel
Great post - very informative and just right for putting the knicker-wetters in their place. However, I'm surprised by your comments on "the alarming rise of socialism in the democratic West." Care to elaborate a little on that?
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threesixty
11:50 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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Infidel
Alot of the BRIC's are having a very hard time right now. Brazil economy is fucked. China isnt doing to well and Russia was hit hard by oil prices dropping seeing as most of their economy is energy based. Not sure about India, but I'd dispute that 4-5% growth thing right now.
Also, People keep focussing on nuclear weapons like it's the only bad thing Russia or anyone can do. In the last 10 yrs, hundreds of thousands of people have died, whole countries have been decimated and not 1 atomic weapon used.
The problem with Russia is that they have nukes not that they will use them. If they were to do the unthinkable like invade another country (like Ukraine.. oh fuck, they already did that one..) who is going to risk getting nuked by them in retaliation?
The reason why Poland and all those other eastern block countries are so edgy is that they know the game theory behind this. Even a nuclear missile is unlikely to mean a nuclear attack in retaliation from NATO members. The UK will say, fuck that, you're on your own with that one.
I dont think any of the eastern bloc countries are safe from russian provocation at the moment. Ukraine proved that completely.
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Infidel
12:04 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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Certainly.
We are seeing an alarming rise in the democratic West of politicians who do not understand how markets work.
Their policy platform is to dismantle the market economy and replace it with a centrally planned economy in which technocrats would decide what to produce, when and how. The exact formula varies by country but the basic theme is the same: the technocrats can pull all the levers of the economy better than the markets.
It isn't just Corbyn, who makes no secret of being a socialist. It's also Sanders in the US, a socialist who has just won the New Hampshire primary and is on course to become the Democratic candidate for President.
Then we have Syriza in Greece and Podemos in Spain -both at the extreme left end of the spectrum. And finally there are all the nationalists, who are mistakenly labelled 'far right' but are in fact nearly all in favour of full blown nationalisation, closing borders to international trade and punitive taxes on 'the rich'. Here I am talking about parties like the National Front in France - Marine Le Pen's economic policy is almost identical to Jeremy Corbyn's.
The facts are that state control of the economy, in every one of its many incarnations, has performed considerably worse than almost any market economy.
As Adam Smith described so elegantly in the 18th century, the price mechanism in a market economy directs resources to the most efficient uses like 'an invisible hand', making everybody richer.
A state planner can't do that. State planners make mistakes because they can't possibly know what aggregate demand for any good or service is and because there is little or no competition in a centrally planned economy. Without competition you don't get creative destruction, you don't get innovation and you don't entrepreneurs.
Or put another way you don't get iPhones, Spotify and Tesla electric cars, you get rotary phones, vinyl records and Trabants.
The support the neo-Marxists are drawing is genuinely concerning. People are drawn to the idea that 'capitalism is failing' because the gap between rich and poor is getting bigger. In fact the gap between rich and poor is irrelevant - what matters is only whether the poor are getting richer, which they are.
In fact the poor are the great beneficiaries of the market economy. The rich don't really notice the accumulation of more wealth but the poor now have universal free education, universal free healthcare, universal free pensions and universal free social security,plus electricity and central heating in every home, none of which existed before 1939. Their lives have been transformed in just a few decades, thanks to the wealth created by the market economy.
The new Marxists would have us all believe that they can run the economy better but every piece of evidence we have suggests they would make a mess of it.
Just ask a Venezuelan.
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The Kronic
12:18 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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The rich don't really notice the accumulation of more wealth
_________
HAHAHAH. Such a fucking knob.
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,
12:24 Thu Feb 18
Re: China v America/West Russia v Turkey/West
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Infidel, are we not, in the west, also experiencing the downside of politicians who are in thrall to the markets. The markets themselves too have not played the straight arrow game either because they have rigged the game.
Sanders does not want to dismantle markets so much as make more people the beneficiaries of the markets. His arguments seem to me also to be more about bankers and money movers than the markets per se.
I cannot name any credible politician in the west who advocates dismantling markets. It's more like they want to curb the excesses without impeding entrepreneurship.
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